Exercise is often touted as the antidote to everything from depression to insomnia. “Take a brisk 10-minute walk on your lunch break and power through that glass ceiling!” magazines often advise (note to mags: What does one do about the sweat on one’s power suit? Because I’m not changing into my Lululemon and nikes for 10 minutes.) But what if it works against you? Gym buddy Allison made an interesting observation on the stretching mats (a.k.a. the mats of ill repute) the other day as we navigated the damp spots of other people’s bodily fluids in order to find a dry spot to leave ours on.
“How much do you sleep?”
I shrugged, “As long as my kids will let me.”
“No,” she said, “if nobody woke you up and you could sleep as much as you wanted, how long would it be?”
Most nights I get 6-7 hours of sleep. I feel like busting out the Rodgers and Hammerstein if I get 8. 9 hours and not only would the hills be alive but I might actually do something about the hills of laundry in bedroom. So I replied intelligently, “I don’t know.”
“Because I’ve noticed that I need about nine hours, maybe even a little more, per night to feel really good. Plus I usually end up taking a nap every afternoon.”
“Okay, that’s still in the range of normal.” Secretly I’m jealous her son lets her sleep that long. Okay, it’s not really a secret.
“Not for me! I used to only need 7 or 8 hours of sleep a night.”
“What changed?”
She cocked an eyebrow. “This. Our workouts.”
And the light went on. Since that conversation about a week ago, I’ve been paying a lot more attention to how my need for sleep correlates with my exercise. You can probably file this under “duh” but the more I exercise, not only do I get hungrier, but I need more sleep. Apparently I am the least introspective person on the block as this revelation was surprising to me.
Elite Athletes
Deena Kastor, of Olympic fame, reportedly sleeps 10 hours a night in addition to taking a two-hour nap every afternoon. This phenomenon is well documented in high-caliber endurance athletes. Steven Spence, another elite marathoner, says that when he trains he literally sleeps half his life away, needing 12 hours a night. Between eating – Kastor eats about 3,000 calories a day despite weighing only 105 lbs – training and sleeping an athlete’s life may not consist of much else.
As Gina Kolata from the NY Times points out:
It’s one of the mysteries of sleep: Why is it that mild exercise can be invigorating, but strenuous endurance exercise — whether it’s crew practice, long runs as training for a marathon or juggling back-to-back workouts to prepare for a triathlon — makes people groggy?
Wannabe Jocks
I am not training for anything. I’m certainly not an Olympian. In fact, while I exercise for many reasons, one of the primary reasons I love it is because it gives me more energy. Except when it doesn’t. I had chalked up my increasing fatigue to a busier schedule and a two-year-old that has suddenly decided his favorite time of day to see mommy is at 3 a.m. but it seems I need to lay some of the blame at the feet of my two-hour-a-day (and sometimes more) workout habit. I’ve talked before about how after a particularly gruelling workout, I’ll be overcome with an overwhelming need to sleep. As in immediately. After starting CrossFit, I remember one day where I literally fell asleep on the kitchen floor while my kids ran circles around me. But I thought these were isolated metabolic events not a pattern. I didn’t notice the sleep creep until Allison pointed it out but she’s right.
This weekend, Gym Buddies Allison, Megan and I decided to hit the trails around a local lake. Megan is training for the Twin Cities Marathon and Allison and I decided to keep her company on her 6 a.m. long run. It was a loooong run. It felt great, mind you, but it was over 3 hours of heart-pumping action. Upon returning home, I managed to stumble through the rest of my morning but crashed for a two hour nap in the afternoon. I dragged through a family outing to the apple orchard and picnic at a park and then I slept 12 hours that night. Yes, you read that right. 12 hours of sleep. Granted I had been up 38 hours straight Thursday and Friday when my friend went into labor (such a privelege to be there when a baby is born so it was totally worth the sleep loss) and I was interrupted twice by said two-year-old but you get the idea.
But Why?
According to Dr. Alex Chediak, president of the American Academy of Sleep Medicine, says that while nobody is sure exactly how or why endurance athletes need more sleep – “Runners are more of a curiosity. And because intense endurance exercise isn’t what most exercisers do, it is not even feasible to reason by inference.” – he thinks it has to do with the release of cytokines, the hormones that signal the immune system.
Kolata further explains:
Exercise prompts muscles to release two cytokines, interleukin 6 andtumor necrosis factor alpha, that make people drowsy and prolong the time they remain sleeping. In fact, those cytokines also are released when people have a cold or infection, which is why people sleep so much when they are ill.It turns out that the single most important factor for increasing the release of those two cytokines is increasing the duration and intensity of exercise, Dr. Chediak said. And, he noted, that’s what is happening when endurance athletes train. “A sprint will not get you as great an effect,” he said.
Energizer Bunny Vs. Sleeping Beauty
This is not what I want from my workouts. I want my exercise to energize me, not deplete me. I think it is obvious from this blog that I often suffer from a more-is-better mentality. I imagine most of you will say, “do less.” I need more instruction than that. Spell it out for me, kids.
So where is that point of diminishing returns? How long should a workout be to give you the energy without the drag? How many hours a night do you sleep? Have you ever noticed your workouts affecting your sleep?
Allison summed up the problem on the stretching mats, “Over the past year, I’ve had to add an hour of sleep per night. I want that hour back.”
Usually when people ask me how I’m doing I honestly say fine. On the very rare occasion after a tough night or very hard morning workout, I have said I’m tired. 100% of the time I have said that, the reply is, “I’m really tired too,” and then they elaborate! So from that, I’ve reached two conclusions:
1) Everyone else is always tired!
2) I’m never going to tell anyone ever again that I’m tired!
Charlotte, I think maybe you are building up a sleep debt during the week. You may function best on 8 to 9 hours a night, but with your schedule, that’s hard to do.
It’s all the balance between diet, exercise, and sleep. Everyone seems a little different, and has to find what works best for them. AM workout, PM workout, higher carbs to burn up, and so forth. Good luck with figuring it out 🙂
From a strength-training perspective, if you don’t get enough sleep for how much you exercise, your muscles won’t recover and you’ll do more damage than good.
Oh for sure! My running makes me need more sleep. I typically need 7, max 8hrs a night to be happy when I am not in season (eg running under 35/40 miles a week). But once I top over 50 miles a week, I NEED 9hrs, like a fish needs water. Oddly I’ve gone as high at 70 and don’t find my sleep needs increase more than 9 (unless I have a sleep debt).
But I don’t mind sleeping more too much because I love running more than staying up that extra hour. :). But I know eventually I’ll have to change my ways.
I know that when I’m not running (or working out…or doing anything at all in my kicks), I turn in to a raging insomniac…but my self-awareness is of the variety that this correlation had to be pointed out to me. So I couldn’t begin to tell you at what point exercise and snoozes reach a happy equilibrium in my life. Somewhere between 0 and 20 mpw?? On the other end of things, I think that any day I run more than 7 mi, my body craves more pillow-time.
Good luck finding your balance!
I’ve noticed just recently that my workouts have gotten a bit harder and I’m falling asleep earlier.. or wanting to sleep during the day. (unfortunately, severe insomnia means I may want to sleep, but I won’t…)
But it seems that 3 workouts a week (1-1.5 hours each) leaves me energized. More leaves me exhausted. With the insomnia problem it’s a delicate balance deciding what’s happening where, though.
Another factor in the crash after a 3-hr run could be your post-nutrition recovery. How you eat and drink both during and after the run can make a big difference!
I’ve always had problems falling asleep 2-3 hours after a run. It doesn’t matter what I eat before or after. Any more than an hours running and I am narcoleptic.
I have found that working out using an interval training principle for about 45 minutes(say, as hard as a going full out at a Spin class, but not as hard as HIIT purely because I couldn’t keep that pace for any longer than 20 minutes even if I wanted to) tends to energise me much more effectively, but much more than that and I’m running the risk of falling asleep at the wheel.
And same as another commenter said here – if I don’t work out, I go insomniac.
All about finding the right balance for you! I think it varies a lot from person to person.
TA x
ooooh very interesting stuff, Char.
Im not tired per se during the day but EMBARRASSINGLY so around 830 pm.
and I always seize the excusetruth m said.
about my needing my sleep to GROW.
(screw beauty:))
M.
Wow, color me clueless as well because I’d never heard about the endurance work leading to a need for more sleep.
I’ve never had the time, joints, or motivation to do intense endurance work. So I’ve never experienced it myself. But this is just one more bit of info that dissuades me from wanting to up my cardio any more than I’m doing now.
Thanks for the info!
After a long run, I’m queen of the powernap. This Sunday, I ran about 2 1/2 hours, got home, cleaned up got breakfast, and then fell asleep in the passenger seat on the way home. Then took a 3 hour nap. And I still went to bed at 10pm. I do tend to sleep my Sundays away.
The upshot? I went from “legs hurt so bad that the toilet is a struggle” to almost completely normal when I woke up. We really do need sleep for recovery.
Interesting post. I don’t think I exercise enough to make a difference. Luckily though I’m afforded a “power nap” in the middle of the day (I live really close to my office) which is nice.
Right now my main genesis of tiredness is that I’m giving up Diet Coke. OMG the withdrawls… trying to keep the eye on the prize!
Kelly
choosinglosing.blogspot.com
I normally get about 7.5 to 8 hours of sleep a night, but since I haven’t been running (stupid leg), I noticed that I can go to bed later and when I wake up in the morning I’m not refreshed at all…just groggy. So basically I feel just the opposite of how I feel when I’m running. 🙁
Yep, I TOTALLY hear you. And I’m far from an elite athlete. Training for IM last year, I found myself wanting to sleep ALL the time. This year, with no IM, it’s not as bad.
And regarding your comment on my blog: YES! You may use any images and text from my blog! And, just so you know, my wife did the same triathlon with me, and she was too cold to get off her bike, so she just peed herself. Yep. And it warmed her up for a bit too!
I have a weird sleeping pattern. Basically my body likes to wake me up multiple times throughout the night and then at 6am it says “okay, its time to get uuuupppp!”.
Maybe I don’t need that much sleep? Maybe I need to exercise more? 🙂
I’d say to try to swap one hour of exercise for a less intense exercise (pilates?) I’m not sure if your gym has classes, but if it does, check them out.
Wow, I am so jealous of your workout motivation. My workouts are usually a half and hour to an hour. Anyway, the hypo-thyroid thing makes you extra tired..even when it is regulated. I sleep about 9 to 10 hours a night, any less and I am just too tired and crabby.
I learn so much every time I read this blog! I have been scratching my head as to why I’ve gone from feeling fine on 6 hours a night to really, really needing (nut not be able to get) at least 7 hours of sleep a night. Hmm…CrossFit and marathon training perhaps? Last Sat I took 2 1.5 hour naps during the day and was still very tired at 11PM. I’m going to have to figure something out because it is only going to get worse between now and November and I just don’t have any extra time. Sigh.
I’ve noticed a bit of the same thing. Since I’ve upped my running I’ve gone from only needing 4- 5 hours of sleep each night to really needing 6 – 7 hours. After my long runs on Sunday, I’ll generally take a 0.5 – 1 hour nap in the afternoon.
(Yeah, I require very little sleep. All the women in my family are like this.)
I think, though, that I’ve found a good balance. I do need more sleep, but not so much that I’m building up a deficit. I also need to eat way more than I was before. I wonder how my need for sleep will change when I start marathon training…..
I’d never really thought about it before, but it seems to make sense to me that past a certain point, more exercise would require more rest. So, I don’t find anything surprising about marathon runners, for example, requiring 12 hours of sleep a night.
I’ve never been (and doubt I ever will be) an endurance athlete of any kind. I exercise just enough to stay healthy and looking good. I have no aspirations to run marathons, triathlons, or anything competitive. So, how to make it work with sleeping and running for hours a day is not something I can help with.
Maybe just evaluate (again) WHY those long workouts are so important, and figure out if the other lifestyle changes really make it worth it. If I get too much exercise, I get more hungry, but moderate exercise doesn’t increase my appetite. At the point where I’m exercising more AND eating more, they seem to cancel each other out, so what’s the point? I’d feel the same way about sleep. Moderate exercise gives me more energy during the day, helps me sleep at night, and I wake up feeling refreshed. If more required more sleep, or made me tired during the day, it wouldn’t be worth it.
I guess, what’s your real motivation for working out 2 hours (or more) a day? If you workout less, will you need less food and less sleep? Could you swap some of that workout time for something *else* that you would enjoy?
I guess it’s hard for me, because I could *maybe* imagine myself enjoying an hour long run every day (if I could find a way to fit that in), but I could never imagine working out 2 hours a day AND ENJOYING IT, unless it was incorporated into something else fun, like beach volleyball or something.
SO, I don’t know, but it is interesting to think about. And I do always wonder with certain athletes (the marathoner you linked to), if the amount of training and the negatives that necessarily come with it (not to mention the fact the female marathoners always look so much older than they are to me), makes it really worth it to them.
I didn’t mean to write something that long, but had to break up a fight between my sons halfway through, and lost my train of thought. Sorry. 🙁
Especially since I’m not sure any of it made any sense or was relevant at all.
When I run an hour+ (or over seven miles) in a day I typically sleep 9-10 solid hours that night. This is one of the reasons I do long runs because otherwise I’m a restless sleeper and wake up multiple times during the night and feel less than cheery in the morning. For the sake of civilization, trust me, you want me to sleep well. When I don’t sleep well, my husband actually calls me the harbinger of the apocalypse.
Shorter runs or workouts make me feel good during the day, but don’t help me sleep.
Finally, an explanation for my wife on why I’m so lazy around the house. Can I send her your way to explain this (legitimize it) to her?
Since my periods of hard exercise tend to correlate with the times my husband is in school and I’m alone with the kids most of the day, I always figured it was the kids who were exhausting me. Hmm. I may need to apologize to them, lol!
I’ve never really noticed a link between exercise and sleep before. I do sometimes feel groggy in the morning…I should pay more attention now to whether it has to do with how much I’ve exercised that week. Normally I get about 7-8 hours a night (except tuesday, which is 6), though on weekends I’ve been known to get 9 (or even 10 if I’m really tired)). I think 8 is a fairly happy medium for me.
I definitely notice that when I started working out at what might be considered a moderate to intense level, I stopped having problems falling asleep most nights, I started sleeping earlier (I’ve always been a night owl), and I needed more sleep. So it makes sense.
I guess in that period of time I also lost a bunch of weight, started trying to go to work earlier, gave up caffeine, and started eating *better* (not “good”, but better). Also, in a week, I generally sleep the same amount, I’m just much less likely to crash for 12 hours on the weekends. Which I prefer!
hmmm … i’ve actually never noticed if my sleep habits have changed thanks to my exercise habits.
things to start looking out for …
At the risk of sounding trite, if you need more sleep as a result of your exercise, you are probably exercising too much. There is a “sweet spot” where exercise is enough to build and energize you, but beyond which you overdo ever-so-slightly and your body seeks sleep (and extra food) in order to repair/recover. It’s survival pure and simple. I spent 20 years as an endurance athlete and slept every moment I could. I realize now it was because I was so often broken down, inflammed, injured, sick or simply hadn’t recovered from the previous day. The sleep was one way my body could attempt to (or for me to) catch up. It’s a fact of life in endurance training. That’s why I don’t do it anymore. OTOH, I am envious of your being able to go on a 3-hour trail run on what was basically a whim. It’s a testament to your overall fitness that you can do that at all. And as long as it’s not a daily thing, it is a totally Primal adventure.
Yes, all true. And, I think endurance training brings on the same sleepy tired need a nap as pregnancy. When I am not pregnant or training long (either is rare these days:-) I find one hour of exercise 4-6 days a week is so lovely and energizing…
I do notice that I have a number of hours per night which is my optimal amount of sleep. If I fall below that, then it builds up and I end up needed super long nights on the week end. So maybe, it would help to have more sleep every night?
I’ve noticed if I don’t work out over 1.5 hours that I don’t sleep well. But I do average 5-6 hours a night, plus a 1-2 hour nap before work. When I worked out over 2 hours, I sleep like a rock but still average my 5-6 hours a night except on Sundays where I sleep in for 9-10 hours (along with my naps before hand during the week). So, yes, excercise is the reason for my midday crash.
Gym Buddy Mike
When I work out 5-6 hours per week, I need a solid 9 hours sleep per night. Naps run in cycles for me. They are usually related to pregnancy, nursing, or inadequate sleep over a week or more. When I don’t work out, I need more like 7-8 hours sleep.
I stopped using an alarm clock almost a decade ago. I get up when my body is good and ready…between 6 and 6:30. Granted, I also go to bed when I get tired, between 9-10pm. (Don’t ever bother to invite me to a late night party. I couldn’t even play CandyLand after 9:30 and I am out cold by 10:05.)
Sleep is top priority for me. And when I don’t get it, everything else goes wrong. I am clumsy, flakey and downright crabby bordering on irrationally fatalistic.
I used to feel guilty and frustrated when I would accidently sleep through my morning workout. But I have learned to let it go and know my body really needed the sleep.
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Try exercising more intensely for shorter periods of time, I’m a boxer so im up at 5:30 every morning for running before boxing in the evening during fight season. As sparring nights are three nights a week, i just jog on those days for about 40 minutes. I find that although it leaves the energy in me and strength left in my legs to spar, it does make me feel more tired throughout the middle of the day. On the days when i don’t spar in the evening I do anerobic excercises, such as 5 sets of 400m sprints with only 45 seconds rest inbetween. It makes my legs feel like lead for the rest of the day but i definately feel more awake and can go to bed later on those days.
Trying working out for less time but at a higher rate and see if it works for you
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I normally workout regularly, but when for some reason I can’t, I find I need less sleep. With exercise I need about 8 hours/night, without exercise I only need around 7.
Recently I just upped the intensity of my cardio workouts, and I find that the follow day I’m always very sleepy, have difficulty getting out of bed. That extra workout intensity is definitely asking my body for more sleep that night.
But I think exercise with enough sleep improves overall energy levels and cognition. So if you can exercise and add the extra sleep as well, I think you’ll be more productive and get more done in life.
People just need to allocate more time to sleep when they also allocate time to exercise. I’m an advocate of quality of waking hours over quantity. So I think I’ll just need to figure out a way to get more sleep and stick with the exercise.