Disappointed. That’s the only way to describe how I felt after my first month of volunteering every day at the battered women’s shelter. It started out all fun and spy games, with the coordinator telling me to meet her on the corner of a crowded intersection and to come alone. Once I got to the shelter, I had to be buzzed in through the razor-wire topped fence by a guard on duty 24 hours a day. The rules were: no men (no male children unless they were under 13), no unapproved visitors, no alcohol, no drugs. Everyone had to go to mandatory counseling and parenting classes. Clearly these people were serious.
I was excited because thanks to losing my daughter Faith and only part-time work teaching at the college, I suddenly had a lot of empty time on my hands. I could either sit at home and stare at my empty nursery or I could get out and Help! People! I’m not sure what I was envisioning (comforting a woman sobbing on my shoulder? Holding a young child while her mom defiantly cut all ties with her abusive husband? Having a walk-on role in the Lifetime movie of the week??) but the entire first week all I did was write thank-you cards to the people who’d contributed money to the shelter. The second week they trusted me enough to man the visitor’s sign-in book. By week 3 I’d moved up to being in charge of the vouchers. And that’s when things started to go from Happy Liberal Fantasy to Crazytown.
Vouchers were tickets for everything from free bus rides to meals at restaurants to groceries to diapers. We did not under any circumstances give out cash. If I did – even if it was from my own funds – I’d be “fired.” This, the coordinator explained, was for my own good. “You’re new and they’re going to try to play you like a fiddle. Just stick to the rules.” I soon saw the wisdom behind her warning. Most of the women who stayed in the shelter were regulars. This wasn’t an emergency crash pad where they could stay until they figured out the best way to move to another state and change all their identifying information. No, this was where they lived until they reached the maximum time and then they’d pack up their myriad tiny children and move on to another shelter (or another bad boyfriend) until they could come back here. This bouncing in and out was their full-time job.
And boy were they good at it. I’ll never forget the first time a resident asked me for two Greyhound bus and four grocery vouchers. I was confused. “Are you leaving already?” I asked her. “No,” she answered frankly, “I can trade those for two bottles of rum at the liquor store. We’re having a party in room 6 tonight if you want to come!” I eyed her barely clad kids staring vacantly into space and considered my answer. Surprisingly when I refused, she didn’t curse me out but just sighed and turned around and left. The party in room 6 happened anyhow, thanks to the policy of the local Lutheran church to give out a one-time handout of $200 to anyone who asked.
I asked the coordinator one day if any of the women here were actually abuse victims or if they were all just working the system. She gave me a very stern look and said, “They’re all abuse victims. Generations of it. They’re also working the system because it’s all they know to survive. And that’s the problem.” I finally realized just a small part of what she was up against and I was amazed all over again that she could come in every day and do this job. Don’t get me wrong, most of the women that I met there were kind and funny and loved their kids. But most of them also had serious substance-abuse and mental-health issues. They weren’t looking to change their lives. Why would they if they’d never known anything different?
By the time I quit 6 months later – because I was pregnant again and the combination of my haywire hormones and seeing all the neglected and abused children was making me cry every night – I was seriously jaded. I don’t want to be uncharitable. Even now, writing about this, I feel as if I’m betraying a vulnerable sisterhood. I kind of want you to comment and tell me that my experience was a bizarre aberration and other shelters aren’t like the one I worked at. And yet, this is what I think of when I read about the argument over what people should be allowed to buy with food stamps. Because I handed out a lot of things like food stamps and I saw them used to buy everything from boxes of Twinkies to cigarettes. The only apples that ever came in the building were in the bowl on the front table and they were fake.
On Friday the federal government struck down Mayor Bloomberg’s proposal to forbid people in New York City from using food stamps to buy soda saying it was “because of the logistical difficulty of sorting out which beverages could or could not be purchased with food stamps and because it would be hard to gauge how effective the step was in reducing obesity.” Bloomberg responded to the U.S.D.A.’s decision saying, ““We think our innovative pilot [program] would have done more to protect people from the crippling effects of preventable illnesses like diabetes and obesity than anything else being proposed elsewhere in this country — and at little or no cost to taxpayers.”
On Friday I also read this opinion piece by Marion Nestle (thanks to Hey Joob for the tip!) about whether or not it is ethical to give unhealthy food like the popular free-meal McDonald’s coupons to the homeless or if we should only give what we would eat, even if that isn’t what they want. The comments are even more enlightening than Nestle’s perspective, especially in regards to what a polarizing and class-dividing feature food has become in America.
The bottom line is that the number one predictor of obesity in this country is not genetics, gender, race, or age – it’s income. The poorer you are the more likely you are to be obese. That’s the problem. So what is the solution? Honestly I’m not sure – a variety of programs from education to farmer’s markets in inner cities to gardens in schools are having promising results – but I do think that not allowing food stamps to be used for soda is a good place to start. (For the record, the government already does have rules for what you can and cannot buy with food stamps, specifically no “alcohol, pet food or heated food”.) I don’t think this is the best or only solution and I hope that NYC is investigating other ways to help people have access to and the education of healthier food options but it seems like a reasonable step to me.
edited to add: Something about this post is deeply bothering me but I can’t put my finger on it. Maybe I’m so opposed to soda because it was such a “danger” food to my eating-disordered brain? Maybe I am unsettled because telling someone what they can and can’t eat is such a slippery slope? I don’t know. I’m conflicted. What I’m saying is that if you see a flaw in my thinking feel free to call me out. I’m going to go to bed now and perhaps I’ll figure it out in the morning… many thanks to those of you who have already commented.
I really look forward to hearing what you think (because I’m sure the comments are going to be better than anything I wrote too) – should the government stay out of (further) legislating what food stamps can and cannot be used to buy? What about giving food to the homeless – should we focus on giving them calorie-dense meals like Big Macs or healthy fare like produce? Anyone else ever have a volunteer job that didn’t turn out quite like you’d expected?
I read Marion Nestle’s post and all the comments with great interest as well. I’m going to cop out and say this doesn’t really fix the larger problem that, due to farm subsidies that make high-fructose corn syrup so cheap, a 2-liter bottle of soda is cheaper than a gallon of milk. I believe people know soda isn’t healthier than milk, but if you have $5 to spend, which will you choose? If I knew the answer I’d probably be in a far more important job than I have now.
Deep sigh.
Good point about the farm subsidies. Hard to fix on a micro level when we have such big issues on a macro level…
But what is the point of buying soda at all? Perhaps people can’t afford to buy milk, but I don’t see how soda is a substitute for milk. Soda is basically a dessert. Water is a drink substitute for milk, and it’s free.
That said, I’m all for getting rid of the HFCS subsidies.
Regulation is a double-edged sword. It’s the reason that we can go to the grocery store and know (for the most part) that the food we buy is safe. Sure, anything in large quantities can be harmful to our health but I don’t know that anyone went to an early grave drinking one can of soda per day.
On the other hand, we saw what happened with prohibition. If the government started controlling the distribution of junk food or how it’s purchased would we start seeing Dorito bootlegging? It sounds ridiculous but I don’t know if it’s out of the realm of possibility.
I wish I had a great solution but ultimately people have choice.
I don’t think anyone is saying that the government can or should prohibit soda. I think they’re just saying that people shouldn’t buy the soda with *food stamps*. Ultimately they wouldn’t be limiting the person’s choice as to what to eat or drink but rather limiting what they can do with the government-assisted food stamps (which they already do – for instance you can’t use them to buy cigarettes).
Agreed with the above commenter…
It’s really hit home since I started on this quest for the optimal diet w/the nutritionist. My grocery bill has almost doubled. Luckily – I can afford it. I can EASILY see how some of the food choices I make now and cringe a little because of the cost would easily be a deal breaker to other folks. Organics can cost a LOT more, and I wasn’t a believer until giving it a try, but I seriously believe so much in how much BETTER I feel it’s worth it. 10 years ago, it wouldn’t have even been an option with the cost – I was living on ramen, pretty much…
I’m not sure limiting what can be purchased with food stamps is the key – to be honest, I’d love to see the focus on bringing down the cost of non-GMO, organic, and natural food.
” I’d love to see the focus on bringing down the cost of non-GMO, organic, and natural food.” I totally agree – I don’t think this ban is the best or only option, just a first step of hopefully many. As for limiting what food stamps can be used for, the government already does that – they just don’t do it with soda…
These are all such hard questions. Wow.
What to feed the poor
Should govt regulate what one can and can’t buy with foodstamps
And everything else you touched on
I live in an urban area where I see homeless people pushing shopping carts and sleeping on the ground. 2 blocks from my doorstep. And there are also 1 million dollar condos on my block. So homeless people are EVERYWHERE here.
They hang out in my area b/c we have fabulous restaurants and I am happy to see them get the restaurant hand-outs that the restaurants are going to throw away otherwise. But sadly I dont think these people care what they eat…whether it’s apples or twinkies. I think it’s us who HAVE food and who know what good food is, what healthy choices mean and are..it’s us who care. They don’t care I am pretty much speculating.
All of these questions I think about DAILY b/c I walk and run past them every day. They are friendly for the most part and I always just wonder…HOW did they get there…what happened…
Yes, I always wanted to ask people the same questions too. When i worked in the shelter I got to hear a lot of women’s stories and they were all terribly sad. There is so little cushion in our society between a decent living and abject poverty.
Not on topic too much, but I’d guess 75% of the truly down and out homeless around here are vets. Even if they don’t have visible physical disability, there’s a lot of trauma, hard to get past, invisible, unsettling.
I thought there already were limits to what you could buy with food stamps. I was behind some people at the grocery store a few years ago that wanted to buy something from the grocery store deli (probably chicken or mashed potatoes) and the clerk told them they couldn’t use the food stamps for that, that it had to be used for food that wasn’t already prepared. So, what the heck would that be? Is soda already prepared? Milk? Cheese? Cheez Whiz? Nutter Butters? Wouldn’t it make more sense to let them buy a whole baked chicken instead of a six pack of soda? But then, it’s the government, so they do very little that makes sense.
Also, everyone does have a choice. But, if someone else is paying your bills (ie, the taxpayer) and they don’t want you to buy something with the money they are giving you, are you not obligated to do as they wish?
Yes, the USDA says you can’t buy “alcohol, pet food or heated food” with food stamps. I’m guessing it was the latter that the people in front of you had trouble with. I added the link to the official site in my post – thanks for the reminder! And yes, I think there is a significant difference between telling someone they can’t buy soda and telling someone that can’t buy soda with food stamps.
I agree with you wholeheartedly, Charlotte, even if I may not fully understand the nuances of the American situation (being an Aussie). Surely part of the fight against obesity is education, which allows individuals to make informed choices. Removing choice is, in my humble opinion, dangerous on all sorts of levels…
Loving the blog, by the way! 🙂
THank you Georgia!! That means a lot to me! And yes, I totally agree about education being the #1 goal of all this.
I have had so many weird volunteer experiences, I can’t even count them. I was very, very involved with our legal aid clinic at law school (our province is the only one that foolishly allows law students to attend court for clients within a week of starting classes!)- and I’ve had a lot of crazy clients. I also helped at two of the shelters in the city- one was helping clients get ID (mostly healthcare cards), and the other was helping management rewrite their policy for new legislation that had been enacted.
It was heartbreaking to realize that I cared more about most of their lives then they did- and also that regardless of whether I helped them, that their lives probably weren’t going to get much better. Once client was a conspiracy theorist- which is hilarious on tv, but absolutely terrifying in person.
I think that safety nets are important (obviously the Canadian political rhetoric was effective on me!), but I do think that individuals who are utilizing the safety net should get to maintain as much autonomy as possible. Thus, I don’t think there should be limits on food stamps being used to buy soda- I think everything in the grocery store should be fair game, and that it should be okay for farmers markets too.
As a broad policy, the true cost of food should be what is actually displayed on the shelves- as in spinach should be super cheap, because it is nutritionally dense; oreos should be super expensive, because they are not nutritionally dense (though they are admittedly delish when crunched up on ice cream….not that I’m having that as a snack right now or anything…). I need to think in nutrition terms though, because produce is ridiculously expensive in this city, and otherwise I may choose to live solely on sugar-laden items.
When I grocery shop, that’s the metric I try to use. Sure- I’m aware that XYZ item is cheaper now, but in 40 years when I’m undergoing triple-bypass surgery for the fifth time, I realllyy doubt I’ll feel the same way.
I should also note that Canadian grocery stores can’t sell alcohol (except Quebec, surprise surprise….), so when I refer to ‘everything in grocery stores’ being fair game, I’m excluding alcohol.
I like this idea, but of course Big Food Inc will never let this happen. Honestly, I’m more worried about what the corporations can & will do to us than any politician.
I love this idea but it comes requisite with the need for education along with the food stamps. Maybe they do a better job of that in Canada than they do in the US?
Erm…no, I don’t think we do a better job of educating- but I do think that we should. Plus, there are also no food stamps in Canada(as far as I know at least), we have alternate programs that are mainly just cash transfers….so the issue of what food stamps can be used on is pretty moot for us.
“It was heartbreaking to realize that I cared more about most of their lives then they did- and also that regardless of whether I helped them, that their lives probably weren’t going to get much better.”
This is exactly how I felt, and I found it enormously frustrating. I did some volunteering with our local mental health charity, and attempted to set up a sports and fitness group. I was SO passionate about the power of physical movement to alleviate some of the symptoms of depression and anxiety… but I don’t think I’d realised the full extent of what severe mental illness is – and I was thrown in at the deep end. It taught me a lot, but I don’t think the service users got quite so much out of it – if anything! The work I do now at our gym and with personal training verges on counselling and my clients and the members get so much more out of working with me in building confidence and overcoming their demons. I thought I was going to be able to change the world, but it seems it’s really not that easy (who knew?)
I would recommend everybody tries volunteering at some time though, it forces you to confront parts of the human condition that, as a society, we tend to sweep under the carpet.
Px
With the digital divide that already exists, let’s not make the food divide even wider. That’s a very scary road. I already feel it when our family goes shopping. We are very lucky to make a decent income and have health insurance. The commenter above is right, legislators need to focus on food production issues, not food consumption issues. It’s like a public computer lab in a library, certain files transfers & sites will take up more bandwidth. There may be quasi-reasonable rules in place about what is acceptable use. But does it make more sense to spend time policing the end users when more energy and manpower can be used upgrading the hardware and software so that they can access what they need?
Love this analogy! And excellent point. I would hope they’d approach the problem from both ends. Unfortunately Mayor Bloomberg and other individual entities don’t have the power to do top-down changes and the people that do (the USDA) won’t…
I think that it is time for the food stamp program to get a major overhaul and I think that it is in the state and federal government’s right to regulate what foods can and cannot be purchased with this aid. That being said, it may also be important for the governmetn to put more money into these programs so that the right nutricious foods are purchased, and that education does need to be made even more available.
There is the fear that this would be government becoming too big and more damageing to the nation by creating more debt, but what is the wiser method of action: continuing with a flawed system that is actually hurtinging those that it’s meant to help, or by corecting and strenthining the program so that it can be a short term fix that will create a strong long-term outcome?
Wonderful blog as always Charlotte!
“continuing with a flawed system that is actually hurtinging those that it’s meant to help, or by corecting and strenthining the program so that it can be a short term fix that will create a strong long-term outcome?” EXACTLY. Thanks for saying it better than I did!
I worked for a non-profit and it definitely changed my perspective, your “Happy Liberal Fantasy to Crazytown” is a perfect description. Especially sad is the amount of untreated mental illness. A coworker told me that during the Reagan era he severally cut mental illness spending, ending most institutionalization and other programs with the promise of releasing them to “community programs”. But none of those community programs were put in place or so severally underfunded they hardly helped. Very sad.
I think there is a big difference between what an individual can choose to do with their own money and what they do with money that is given to them. Plus the government ALREADY does it. The WIC (women infants and children) Program has very strict limits on what you can buy or not buy and I have seen it have much more positive results than food stamps.
There was an article in my local paper not to long ago that compared the cost of eating healthy to eating junk food and surprise….junk food was a lot cheaper. But that is a much larger issue with the agribusiness industry, subsidies and tariffs. Sad that people lose out in the end.
I totally agree with this: ” Especially sad is the amount of untreated mental illness.” All of our counseling etc was like putting a band-aid on a gaping wound. Helped for a moment but def didn’t address the underlying issues.
Mental illness is really the underlying issue – and it’s generational, as the director you worked with touched on. Just an example: we moved to Portland, OR just after the state closed all state mental institutions and kicked everyone out into the streets. The city, and indeed the state, are still reeling from the effects. In the late 80s, early 90s, I worked downtown during holidays from college and encountered so many homeless (with and without children). I had some frightening experiences and some unexpected lovely ones – you can’t guess what response you’ll get no matter what the person(s) look like or if they have kids with them. Also, many ‘activists’ take advantage of those homeless with kids and pay them (cash!) to stand and hold signs supporting whatever and get their pics in the paper and on the news. Oh, those sad looking children holding such sad, pitiful signs. (In other words, don’t believe every picture you see.) I did buy many a McD’s meal to hand out – it was better than giving them cash. Some were grateful, some were ugly. I hold on to the memory of those who were grateful and ate. This is a really tough topic – thank you for taking it on.
I love this: ” I hold on to the memory of those who were grateful and ate.” and I do the same. Maybe soon I can post about some of the amazing experiences I had at that job (although admittedly they were much less frequent than the depressing ones…) THanks for the reminder!
i have a hard time telling anyone how to eat because of my past…and because i feel the pressure that if they don’t succeed it will be my fault. i wonder if that is what’s bothering you? also this is such a sticky situation because who can judge these individuals if this is all they know.
“and because i feel the pressure that if they don’t succeed it will be my fault.” Interesting! This may indeed be part of it. I have a tendency to take responsibility for other people’s actions…
Sometimes I wonder if there really IS an answer. I discussed some of this with my mom yesterday while driving her to the airport. I believe, if these issues are going to be addressed at all, it is going to take years and years of baby steps that will accumulate, like with smoking. The movement *is* making some forward progress though. While Bloomberg’s proposal may have been denied (for which I have not yet decided on an opinion of), at least it shows an effort in the name of health from someone in the government. And to promote actual health at that, not just support fortifying corn and soy products with crap.
Re. Nestle: It was SUPER intriguing! As I was reading the comments, I kept switching back and forth on my opinion. Ultimately, I think I agreed with one man that said the homeless are no less people because of their circumstances. Let them make the choice of what they’ll accept from you or what they want/need. Though I would be happiest if they wanted the healthy food, I realize I live in a fantasy world. I thought the comments of people disgusted with the thought of giving starving people fast food were *slightly* portentous.
PS. Thanks for the shout!
There are def. no easy answers (and likely no “one” answer) to this problem but I do love that people are talking about it and working on it.
I don’t think the government can limit what people purchase with food stamps while still being so heavily influenced by the food lobbyist. It will never happen. I still go back to what I have said before on this blog. When I lived in Japan, their poor people ate MUCH healthier than ours (and China, etc.). They eat rice and vegetables and fish/meat…because that is cheap in their country. Doritos and junk food is very expensive over there and people don’t buy nearly as much of it. So long as we keep the cost of processed foods **artificially** low, it will never change here. It is frustrating for me because I would love to live on Doritos, but I don’t. And I manage to feed my family healthy food, on a budget (not organic, mind you). It DOES take time and effort and sometimes that means staying up late to prepare or chop items or cook lots of meals at once and freeze them to save money.
Incidentally, did you see on CNN money last week that 46 million Americans are on food stamps? Staggering!!!!!
I didn’t see that but that is a shocking number. Good point about the cost of junk being kept artificially low by the food lobbies. Was it Food Inc. that talked a lot about that? (King Corn? I get all my nutrition docus messed up lol)
I found the argument that it would be “too complicated” to exclude pop/soda purchase. Just add it to the list of what can’t be purchased, like the items you mentioned. The rules say that you can’t buy toothpaste or toilet paper with food stamps is those items are not food. I submit pop/soda is not food.
Hahah – I totally agree!
This debate frustrates me because I have yet to see a point of view from anyone who was a child on food stamps and lived to tell the tale before anyone thought of banning food items. Well, I was. And I think what frustrates me the most is the idea that well-meaning, middle-class white people can somehow save the poor, impoverished folks who have to go on welfare to feed their kids and are too stupid to know any better than to feed them soda and chips and lead them to a lifetime of obesity and malnutrition.
It’s not anyone’s place to legislate what goes into anyone else’s body, nor should it ever be.
There are thousands of equally unhealthy things (Hello, Kool-Aid?) you can buy with food stamps. You know what you can’t buy? Diapers. Formula. But there is a program for that, which only allows the purchase of specifically approved nutritious food, and it’s called WIC. (Women, Infants, and Children). Soda is not evil, and forbidding something has never solved anything. I grew up a healthy, happy, well-fed (poor, white) child, and I’m sure I had the occasional soda on special occasions, and it didn’t kill me – but imagine how frustrated my mom would have been if I had wanted a soda on some special occasion and she couldn’t buy me one. What if it were my birthday, and she could use food stamps to buy me a cake and chips for a party but no soda? Banning soda makes wide assumptions about the manner in which soda is consumed and given to children.
Banning soda won’t fix anything. Educating parents about the importance of proper nutrition, giving better access to fresh food, eliminating food deserts in urban areas- these things will help. When you have no car and the only place to get food is the bodega on the corner that doesn’t even always have milk, or even cold cuts (true story – the one closest to my apartment in college was always out of milk, bread, and deli cheese) – what are you going to feed your kids? These aren’t people who can just hop in their Prius and go get lunch at Whole Foods, and the issue is bigger than soda. And eating healthy IS expensive and frustrating – I am no longer a poor college kid, but I don’t have a car, and it’s easier for me to get to a convenience store in my suburban neighborhood than it is to get to the grocery store, although I understand the importance of making that effort, it’s exhausting to haul groceries home on the bus. It’s easier to get a sandwich around the corner for dinner. And sometimes it feels cheaper when I’m spending $100 on two bags of groceries that aren’t even 100% organic, etc, etc, because as a well-paid adult, I still can’t afford to buy every single item in my cart organic.
But of course, the problem is soda.
I agree with you. I couldn’t quite gather my thoughts into a coherent statement but you have expressed it so well.
My family didn’t use food stamps, but we didn’t have a lot of money and my parents managed to feed us healthy food. We had soda on the weekends as a treat and none of us were overweight or even chubby. The problem is so much bigger than whether or not someone buys soda.
Agreed.
I have some strong opinions on this, which I expressed a couple years ago here: http://malevolent-andrea.blogspot.com/2009/08/more-supermarket-thoughts.html
YES. Thank you for writing so eloquently what I was trying to get across.
I think this ” Banning soda makes wide assumptions about the manner in which soda is consumed and given to children.” may be what was bothering me so much about my post last night. Thank you for pointing this out! And thank you for sharing your experience with us. There are definitely as many different situations as there are different people.
I totally agree with this comment. Very well said.
🙂 Marion
I agree food stamps shouldn’t be used for soda. I think food stamps should only be allowed to be used for healthy, whole foods. It isn’t my right to tell you what to eat if you spend your own money, but if you are using someone else’s money to buy food, why shouldn’t someone else have the right to tell you what to eat?
I grew up in Detroit. My parents were well educated and well paid – so we drove to the burbs to grocery shop. Lots of people couldn’t do that. The grocery store in our neighborhood (you know, the one we went to in extreme mom is in the middle of the dish and needs xyz NOW) was the most disgusting grocery store. It was dark, probably to hide the fact that all the produce was about 5 days past good. The produce section was incredibly small, the fresh meat section even smaller. 95% of the store was processed, packaged food. And a lot of people from the other side of the big major road we lived off of HAD to shop there. They didn’t have the money, information, or ability to go anywhere else. The “haves” on my side of the road never went there aside from a quick stop for something they really needed ASAP.
So the question is – if you start banning processed foods – where do the “have nots” go to buy food? No matter what is banned or not, the fact of the matter is that with no education on nutrition, most people will make their dollar stretch as far as they can. And in the US – that means cheap processed foods. With poor quality fresh meats and produce, there really isn’t an option for lots of people. We need to think not just about the cost, but the availability. Until we make it a point in this country to make fresh foods more cost effective for some families, this debate will rage on. And growing up in the inner city – I can appreciate that availability and access are HUGE issues that tend to be ignored. If people have to spend the money to drive about 40 minutes to grocery shop (that’s what we did growing up), then how much does that cost? And how do they do it if they don’t have cars? Fact of the matter is that we don’t create an environment that pushes people towards the better for you alternatives – that is the REAL problem.
“we don’t create an environment that pushes people towards the better for you alternatives – that is the REAL problem.” I totally agree. I don’t think banning soda is the best solution by a long shot – education, availability etc. are far more important.
Because of cuts for mental health programs in the 80’s, and the complete lack of safety nets, we have many more mentally ill people living on the streets now than we had 30 years ago. Which leads to generations of abuse and neglect and dependency on government assistance. You’re right: most folks will stay stuck, and their kids will be stuck, because there’s no emphasis on (or money for) education or opportunities to get out.
This is a HUGE issue for me, as my uncle was living in a government subsidized halfway house in the 80’s. When he was told that he’d have to leave because of funding cuts, he hanged himself, rather than be a “burden” on his family. So I have VERY strong feelings about the way we treat people with metal illness, our definition of it, and how we help the most vulnerable members of our society. Of course, having 2 autistic kids makes me wonder and worry about what will become of them after I’m gone. Will the country decide there’s not enough money to give them the support they need? Will they end up on the street? Will whatever money we put away for their future be enough?
I firmly believe that we must help people who need help. I also believe the money used to help them must be spent in a smart, common-sense way. So I guess this a roundabout way of agreeing that corn subsidies and the like aren’t the best use of taxpayer money. The solution has to come from macroeconomics, not micro.
Oh wow, I am so so sorry about your uncle! I remember you sharing that story before and it breaks my heart, as do your worries about your kids. Mental illness is a very serious and not-well managed issue in our country.
Soda can be bought with food stamps because is is a “food” that is not prohibited by law from being fed to minors. It is unbelievably classist to say that because someone doesn’t meet some minimum income requirement, they have lost the right to act as a parent.
Obesity among children is a rising problem, and as you pointed out, being poor is one of the “risk factors”. However, there are plenty of obese middle and upper class children whose parents feed them soda, sugar-laden fruit drinks, chips, candy, etc. But that’s OK since they’re wealthy, I guess.
Actually I’d never say it’s ok to feed any kid soda, no matter their income level (but we have already established I’m a little crazy in that way). And you’re right, one of the saddest parts of this argument is how “classist” it is.
For what it’s worth, I totally agree with you regarding soda and children. But, I do think that’s a decision for the parents (who should have access to sound nutritional advice), and until it’s banned for all kids, why single out the poor?
To me, the difference is that the wealthy parents are using their own money to buy those (admittedly totally unhealthy) things, versus accepting a handout because you can’t afford to eat and then using it on a “dessert” like soda. That’s like asking for donations to help outfit your kid in (insert designer brand here) instead of buying cheap clothes at Walmart/thrift stores/etc.
There are a few instances regarding homeless and people with access cards (welfare) that I have witnessed that really bug me in regards to the food issues you discussed.
First off, on so many occassions what I see people chose to buy at the grocery store with their access cards astounds me. I watch them, with their hair and nails all done up far too often, in there loading up the belt with things like soda, chips, junk food, etc. Where are the veggies and fruit they should also have up there, especially when there are children along. And why is it that you claim to have no money and have to be on welfare, yet you seem to have enough for conveniences like fake nails and cable? Another time I was at a gas station and I saw a woman purchasing a dozen donuts with her access card. Are you kidding me? I’m not saying everyone on that system abuses it, but there really are a ton, and unfortunately the way it is set up, what they buy can’t be monitered too easily.
As far as homeless, I have a good friend who did not have cash on her ‘for food’ as the man requestion, so instead she handed him an apple, which she had on hand and it is a healthy food. You know what this man did? He took the apple and threw it, angry that she hadn’t given him cash instead. Perhaps he is not legit, but I would think no matter what type of food it is, they would be grateful. I do understand trying to get them healthier food as you discussed, HOWEVER, in their circumstances I really think any food is welcomed that you can provide. To often they don’t get enough of any kind. But for those who use access cards and have a choice, I do wish that could be regulated a little bit more than it is.
I wasn’t going to comment on this at first, but I couldn’t help myself. The whole food stamp/EBT system irritates me for several reasons that I won’t go into. However, after seeing the investigative reports done by news stations in Minnesota where people ARE using their EBT cards to purchase alcohol, cigarettes and lottery tickets, it’s clear the system needs an overhaul.
A few months ago, I was in line at the grocery store behind a woman who was paying with food stamps. Her entire cart was filled with 2 liter bottles of soda, bags of chips and huge bags of candy. She also happened to be obese. It makes me agree that more closely monitoring how welfare dollars are spent is important.
I think everyone on all sides of the argument will agree that the system needs an overhaul…
Helping others is a wonderful way to help ourselves! Good for you, Charlotte!
I support social welfare programs but I think they need limits. I volunteered for a while at a rural health clinic. The staff was wonderful, some of the patients were not. Unfortunately, there are times when people who are getting something for free feel entitled and show little gratitude to those who are giving their time and spending money to volunteer.
I understand why you feel conflicted. The black and white of this argument is super easy, i.e. you should be able to buy fresh fruit with food stamps and should not be able to buy crack. The gray area is so tough though. If we say you can’t buy junk food, that means you can’t buy your kid a birthday cupcake or some other treat. (Yes, I know its not necessary to survival, but it is a societal norm and it is the first example that came into my head). The gray area aways sucks.
Thank you, yes! And most of it falls in the gray area…
you make some excellent points Charlotte. do people know / care whether the apple or twinkie is better for them? maybe, maybe not… but I think on some level we all know an apple is a “better” choice than a bag of chips. I think it’s ludicrous that people are draining the system to buy twinkies, booze and cigarettes and then using the system to support their medical costs because of these behaviors. I don’t really have any game plan solution that would “fix” everything, but I think banning soda from food stamps is a start, a step in the right direction. On the other hand, I just read that even with calorie counts and healtheir menu options, people aren’t necessarily making “better” choices. Maybe people are just in denial that THEIR choices lead to certain consequences, such as diabetes? lack of personal responsibility?
It just grosses me out about how heathy food is way over priced and processed crap is affordable. We are on a budget like most families and you know our situation but as soon as we get our own place and I have my own kitchen I intended to cook almost every night with healthyish recipes for my family!
sigh. This is a big issue in every part of our country and banning soda from the list would be nice but that doesn’t mean there won’t be a way around it. I’ve watched parents go to the store and buy the maximum they can with their card, sell back to their friends for the cash and use that to buy the cigarettes, alcohol etc that they want. It would be the same for soda. yes soda is a huge factor in obesity. I am sickened at the store as well when I see all the crap that MY tax dollars from my husband who was working two jobs so that we didn’t have to go on public aid were buying. Then again I don’t know the circumstances of every person on the government dole. Some are long time regulars and others are those who are so embarrassed and had to do it for a quick fix for a short term that it’s hard to judge. Well I do judge when I see people get into the Cadillac Escalade because I would be selling that sucker before I went on public aid. *grant it that doesn’t mean they own the cadillac because they are getting in but it’s still doesn’t look right.
Yes, there are so many unknowns and different situations! My gut instinct is to say we shouldn’t judge. Period. Except that we (as a society) have to. At the very least we have to judge whether or not someone meets the criteria for food stamps and with other programs like WIC, we have to make a lot more judgements. I do like to assume though that people generally do the best with what they have. We just need to make sure that everyone has access to better things/education/enivornment etc.
ON FOOD DESERTS…
http://youtu.be/iEWriN6kh3c
This is a great TEDx video on food deserts where it shows that a majority of places (in geographic concentrations) that accept food debit cards are actually not big grocery stores but combo liquor/convenience stores.
ON MENTAL ILLNESS…
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/08/21/magazine/do-you-suffer-from-decision-fatigue.html
I think it’s really easy to conflate mental illness with socio-economic status. SES status is more of a risk factor. Less resources (monetarily, healthcare and mental energy-wise) are available to to deal issues. Wealth accumulation, in general is mostly about risk aversion (paying 5 workers to do the work of 15 and not giving them health benefits)– shifting the risk onto others. (hiring 7 part time workers with “flexible schedules” and no benefits 30 hrs a week rather than 5 workers who do might do 40 hrs/wk + overtime). Spending less time and money on quality worker training and developing safe manufacturing systems processes (which all companies claim they do) and instead hiring several low-wage “I’ll do anything to survive” workers who you know won’t put up a fight. I just wish that the people on Wall Street and the policy makers would just quit abstracting money like it’s some kind of fru-fru new age lifesource. It’s not an abstract thing, behind every dollar is a bar of gold (we’ll keep dividing and inflating money it until we have to measure it in atoms) and a cost to be paid in human lives. Western society is coming to a point where we are realizing that there are finite amounts of physical resources and our physical and societal infrastructures (political and physical) cannot spread them out equally. As we run out of physical resources we move on to exploit human resources. Wealth accumulation to a point, can also be a symptom of and risk factor for mental illness insofar as it can facilitate sociopathic relations (devaluation of people) and obsessive-compulsive acquisition. We’re going to find mental illness (in all degrees of severity) across all income/wealth levels. However, both ends of the spectrum being rich and poor, one might have more risk for mental illness. (Yeah, no PhD or study to back it up, but just an idea).
ON WORKING THE SYSTEM…
It’s human adaptation at it’s finest. From a feminist point of view, welfare can be damaging and turn the US into a Daddy state, supplanting the stereotypical male father figure in a household. I live and work in a lower-middle class community. We are not completely destitute but I have seen the Escalade/nails done/using EBT debit food stamps stereotype, and heard of the “I’ll bring you in a new social security number next week so I can keep working, then drive away in my Lexus.” scenarios. However, one bad apple does not spoil the whole bushel. It’s the people that we don’t see during normal daylight hours that need us the the most. They’re the ones working double shifts at minimum wage and taking 2 bus rides to work. They are the one’s who feel a lump in their breast and pray it goes away. We’re humans we’re going to judge others, it’s in our nature to look for “trustworthiness” look for scenarios that match up what we think already. Let’s not focus on the outliers. We’re going to miss the big picture.
ON ALCOHOL…
***see food deserts video. We’ll rich or poor, drinking for some, is the only thing they have.
Very enlightening – thanks for all the links. Going to go read them now…
I don’t think we have any food stamps or vouchers here in the UK, I think most welfare payments are cash, and every now and again articles appear in the press saying that vouchers should be given instead so parents couldn’t use their child benefits to buy their cigarettes.
I certainly think it would be better if vouchers were provided that could only be redeemed at certain shops, supermarkets etc, with restrictions for cigarettes and alcohol etc, but saying a person should never buy pop or cake or whatever just because they rely on government handouts doesn’t seem right either. And yet without that there are always those who abuse the system.
No right answer.
I think it’s OK to not let people spend food vouchers on pop. They’re for FOOD. I know everyone needs a treat, but I think that if you’re reciving assistance to buy your food, it should be spend on the healthy nutritritious food.
I also think initiative like one in my hometown should go forward – a subsidized grocery in a poor area of town so people can get more healthy food. They also have classes to teach how to cook healthy but cheapmeals.
I know I”ve discovered it really expensive to eat healthy. That’s got to change.
“I know I”ve discovered it really expensive to eat healthy. That’s got to change.” Amen to that!
It is such a hard & complicated subject Charlotte. I don’t even know what to say. I certainly would rather give a pan handler a fast food coupon than money since I am afraid they may buy booze or cigarettes with it vs. some food they need, even if it is fast food.
Poverty – those areas – have so little access to healthy alternatives as well.
I wish there were easy answers but there are not….
I have heard talks here in NJ about mandatory drug testing before food stamps are given out.
But you’ve got to wonder how that can possibly be fair. Social welfare is designed, ostensibly, to help those in need. Everyone needs to eat. We spend taxpayer’s money to feed killers on death row. We should feed drug addicts. When it come to food, there should not be any judging involved.
Good point!
To me this isn’t about policing individuals, it’s about setting standards at a much higher level. As others have said, spending a society’s common funds on subsidies that deliver cheap toxins back to the populace disguised as pseudo-food has to stop, but that’s a bigger goal. In the mean time, one of the ways to make that mechanism both visible and less viable is to make it less profitable. How do you cut the market share on a drug? Make it socially and legally unacceptable. To do that there have to be standards of what is acceptable as food.
Americans are so vehement about their freedoms that those freedoms are used against them – such as labelling crap as food – and they will still defend it. Okay, it’s the principle. But sustainable societal behaviour also has principles and at some stage they’re going to conflict with freedoms. As a society – NOT any one subgroup – a decision must be made about which of those competing values has priority.
People without agency (control, power, impact over their life or environment) yell the loudest about freedom. These are not the same; we cannot give one as a proxy for the other. Without agency there is no pride and no responsibility. Freedom without agency leads to bad choices – I can do whatever I want and it won’t matter/ no one cares.
Those subsisting by common benevolence are the purest representation of that society’s core messages, be that about “decent” housing, how babies should be fed, or what consititutes food, because the representative of the population is providing those things to them. Taking soda off the list of food-stamp-eligible groceries is about putting an espoused value into practice. It must, however, impact everyone. Being able to afford to make unaccepted choices does not make them any more acceptable (except in Hollywood idolatry). Other steps must simultaneously be taken in other areas to make the corn industry less profitable, such as labelling HFCS a toxin or drug. I do understand that we’re talkng about different levels of government, but when did government forget that it represents the populace, no matter how large or small the portion of the country that is? Why is the right hand fighting the left?
While I’m offending everyone anyway, I’ll say that I don’t accept the argument that labelling HFCS a drug will ruin farmers and we can’t do that. It’s a propped-up industry, and anyone in it knows it. Perhaps if it weren’t so rigged for megacorporations the small mixed farm would be more profitable. And perhaps we just don’t need nearly as many farms as we have. Nobody’s propping up the chimney sweeps!
Basically I think everything flows from the value system. If the result isn’t what is wanted, where did the decision chain depart from the core values? Do the values need changing, or the outcome? If a subgroup acts differently to the majority, what values do their actions reveal?
Now that WIC includes fresh fruits and vegetables on its restrictive food list, urban food stores have started to carry more fruits and vegetables (at least that’s what NPR in Boston reported). So perhaps if food stamps carried more restrictions, more healthful choices would be more available in urban stores.
In the 90’s, the welfare system started cutting people off after 2 years. Apparently the shelters for abused women ended up taking in some of these families.
I am totally for banning soda. Children don’t know to drink it unless it is given to them. I have an almost 5-yr old that has never tasted soda and has never asked for it. What about drinking iced tea instead of soda? You can make it so quick and easy. If you have to have it sweet you can definitely adjust it to your liking. I am pretty certain that a 5 lb. bag of sugar and a box of tea bags are a whole lot cheaper than buying soda:-)
Really great post Charlotte! And, an interesting discussion … I’ve witnessed the buying “bad” foods with food stamps – and, yes, found it frustrating. I also read a great essay several years ago in Newsweek – “Messages from a Welfare Mom” by Ramona Parish. (Couldn’t find a link to share for it, but have a hard copy.) And, that gave me a different perspective. Her shame and heartbreak and frustration – just the hardness of the life she described felt so beyond a simple fix.
Still, in this discussion, I wondered about the role of personal responsibility? I’m thinking the current system cripples the ability that people have to begin to take responsibility for themselves. So … we have the problem of generations of people stuck and having no better options … that long-term solution might be the thing to aim for, to change the direction …
And, I also wondered about mental health, education … and I’m certain there’s an underlying frustration. Eating things like soda and candy, etc., might feel comforting when so much else feels wrong in your life, it might also be another way of manipulating the system.
It could be ignorance … I just wrote a kids’ book on eating well, and I think the greater problem is that nutritional education may be lacking. I’ve always grown up with information about eating well (thanks mom!) – and even with that, it isn’t always easy to make good food choices.
Very provocative topic!
I was on food stamps at one time. I did scam the system to get cigarettes, I was addicted. I don’t think anything should be handed out without anything in return. Hand outs don’t teach anything, except how to beg. It doesn’t give self respect, confidence or skills. The underlying problems need to be addressed. I needed counseling and job skills back then. Handing me food stamps kept me going, but it didn’t change anything.
I don’t necessarily agree that eating well is more expensive, beans and rice and canned vegetables are still cheap. While the best form of eating might be more expensive, you can eat well on the cheap. Often, people who need a lot of help do not know how to cook, budget or plan. If your parents don’t teach you, who will? School? Home ec went out the window years ago. TV- yeah, that’ll teach realistic life skills. (Tongue firmly in cheek) Where do people go to learn basic life skills if not at home?
I worked in a rehab for awhile. One of the counselors said that most of the people they see now need “habilitation” not rehabilitation. They have no baseline of good habits to return to. They were never raised to learn, get a job or do anything but exist from moment to moment. their parents were messed up, and these kids grow up with no skills. Our town has a program, LOVE, INC. -Love in the name of Christ, that addresses those issues. You can go to them for food, transportation, a place to stay, etc. But, they screen people and try and address the real needs, not presenting ones. They have parenting classes, cooking, budgeting, and mentoring programs.
The real answers are not easy, I do agree though that we do need to tie giving to expecting. not in a mean way, but in a way that encourages equality and self respect. Remember the Civilian Conservation Core? Something like that.
I’ve never been on food stamps or other assistance, but I’ve been thinking a lot about food security lately. I’m a student on a very limited budget, and there’s been a time recently when pasta + hotsauce was dinner, because that’s what I had and I didn’t have money for anything else. I’m home right now and visiting my parents and I have something of the opposite problem — my mom’s a food hoarder. You could probably feed a family of six for a month on the contents of the fridge/freezer alone. Each dinner is a minimum of 3 courses, large doses of meat / potatoes/ butter involved. And I eat all of it, because turning anything down makes my mom really upset, even though it’s 10 times richer and more abundant that I’m used to lately. I realize that it’s part of this mindset that I was raised with — ‘buy now, you may not find it for this price later.’ ‘Eat now, it may not be there later.’
It got me thinking — being hungry is, in some weird ways and cases, a privilege. It means you’re pretty sure that in a pinch, you will have the money at that moment to buy food when you really need it. You won’t need to live off stores in your pantry, like I did last month. It ties in with other hoarder mentalities (“I may need this bit of string!”) that my mom and I also share. I’ve been reading a lot of simple living blogs lately, and they really are like diet blogs, but few acknowledge what level of security is needed to live without the safety net of abundant (filling/cheap/calorie dense) food or collections of useful (scraps of fabric/bits of string/ wires/mugs/whatever). When I’ve been really pinched in my budget, I notice I eat bigger portions. It’s counter intuitive, because theoretically eating less would save me money on food, right? But something gets tripped in my head that says “I might need this energy, it’s here now, I’m going to eat all of this.” I’m hoping being more conscious of it will help me keep things in check. If nothing else, I can probably live off the 20 lbs I’m gaining on my parental visit for a while…
Reading through the comments really made me think about this post Charlotte. You bring up some interesting points as do your readers, and sadly enough there is no easy answer. I did not grow up poor and never had to worry about where my next meal would come from. For that I am extremely grateful, and I have no idea what it’s like to rely on food stamps. My brain tells me that people receiving assistance should only be allowed to buy healthy food. However, my heart broke when I read Alanna’s comment. Who are we to decide what foodstamp users can or cannot eat? I agree with the other commenters that said education is key as well as making healthy food more readily available and cheaper.
I agree that we need to educate the people that are asking for the assistance of the government when they are put on welfare or food stamps. Education is the key point on this topic. If only the government funded programs that made the people who apply for assistance attend a mandatory nutritious foods course to educate them on the value of what they get at the grocery store will help their children and themselves in living a healthier life. i agree with the above comments that it is not expensive to eat healthy. Beans,rice.canned veggies are still rather a cheap buy. The people on assistance have to take responsibility of being knowledgeable what to buy their children and sodas are not a bad thing as long as its not abused as an alternative to healthy choices.
I don’t think the government has any business telling us what to put in our mouths rich or poor. Sure they can “educate” but half the time their education sucks. Honestly, I have issues with the government providing food stamps as well. I think taking care of the poor should be a private non-profit effort.
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Hi all,
I really appreciate Laurel’s response. It’ really hard for people who haven’t been through similar experiences as homeless to know how difficult basic day to day activities are. I have recently been exposed to many people living in government housing (Australia) and I am discovering that people who have addictions are not able to take care of themselves. Meeting their addictive habits is more paramount than eating healthy food or eating at all. Unfortunately these people are not well, don’t have the family or good friends to look after them or educate them about good eating habits. They know how to work the system, but they have to to survive. They’ve got nothing else. I see alot of emotional pain and trauma amongst these people who suffer. They are really suffering and don’t know how to alleviate the pain except through addictions. I think that the best healer is love and this needs to be unconditional. Spiritual awareness seems to help. If you are volunteering or helping someone in need, try not to expect any result or changes. Give only the things that you can afford to lose. This way, we will not pass judgements on them nor feel upset or sad about our efforts. Charlotte I feel for you and it’s great what you’ve done. However if the efforts of helping others at the shelter were draining your energy, it’s not the right for you. Perhaps you could help others in other ways. Please try to have compassion on those who suffer. I think that we as a society needs to be warmer and more caring towards those who are in pain. Passing judgements and expecting them to change in a pace that is not possible is only harmful. A smile or a chat to the one’s who feel isolated, lonely and parnoid will make their day. Hopefully one day they will realize that changing their habits will bring more contentment. Take care all.